If Scrivener Sync, Make Spreadsheet match Outline

Q & A
#1

I know this issue comes up and I get why, but…

It makes no sense, if I’m syncing with Scrivener, to have the spreadsheet contain elements that no longer exist in the manuscript. Maybe have a Settings toggle “use narrative position” or, even better, a criteria in the code: “if Scrivener sync, toggle use narrative position”.

Is there a way to have a column in the spreadsheet with Narrative Position; it does appear on the timeline?

I am making do with the “not in narrative” filter. The rest of AT is phenomenal!

Grouchy

#2

If go to tab next to content there is a sort option including Narrative position try that and see if works.
see images

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And now Narrative position. The first scenes are in both date and narrative order.
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#4

I’m not sure I fully follow the question, so forgive me if I miss the mark…

AT gives us timeline views showing events in chronological order, and narrative views showing events in the order of our story and that optionally sync with Scrivener.

In version 3.4, the Spreadsheet tab is a timeline view, not a narrative view; it is not intended to reflect, necessarily, the order of things in a story. For that, one of the narrative tabs should be used.

In the forthcoming version 3.5, you can create custom tabs of either the timeline type or the narrative type. In my case, I have a tab “Spreadsheet Timeline,” which doesn’t reflect my story narrative or sync with Scrivener, and a tab “Spreadsheet Narrative,” which does.

Is this at all helpful?

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#5

I’m ending up with orphaned events in the spreadsheet that do not exist in the outline or scrivener manuscript.

Do you have the same experience?

I marvel at how well the scrivener sync works; outline is always in sync with my manuscript. It just seems to leave the spreadsheet littered.

I’m assuming the screenshots above in the previous reply is showing ver. 3.5.

Yes, that new functionality will be helpful. Maybe that is the answer; the spreadsheet, over time, will have litter. I just have to accept that.

Just like one of our cattle dogs who does not want to stop something… “Bill, leave it!” :slight_smile:

I get the two perspectives: time and narrative. And I also understand referential integrity challenges in database application development.

However, why leave orphaned events in the spreadsheet that no longer exist in the scrivener manuscript? If nothing else, filter them out on the app side or offer the user a way to hide them.

Thanks, now I will leave it,
Bill

#6

The Spreadsheet tab shows events that might or might not be in your story’s narrative. This is by design.

On the other hand, the Outline and Narrative tabs, which sync with Scrivener, show the events in your story, in the order they appear in your story even if the order is not chronological.

I’m not sure I’m helping. Hope so.

Steve

PS: Yes, I believe @Goaliedad posted screenshots from the 3.5 beta.

1 Like
#7

Do you have the same issue of orphaned events?

#8

Good question. If you mean events in the Timeline, Spreadsheet, or Subway tabs that are neither in my narrative in Scrivener nor in the synced Outline or Narrative tabs, yes. This is a feature, not a bug. :nerd_face:

(I’m referring to how things work in version 3.4.)

#9

Haha.

I do get it and that probably implies we will have ongoing maintenance to remove dates from orphaned spreadsheet events in order to remove them from the timeline and most importantly for me, the subway, eh?

Tell me the new narrative sort option can filter the timeline and subway.

Also, this is a trivial thing in the grand scheme of things. Now that I am fluent & confident with AT metadata and the scrivener sync process, I should, periodically, simply create a new AT project. Perhaps with each draft or manuscript snapshot.

Wouldn’t it be cool to script that?

I :orange_heart: AT. Nobody else comes close to what these folks do.

Cheers

#10

Yes, you may find yourself cleaning up some unwanted timeline events.

Tell me the new narrative sort option can filter the timeline and subway.

In 3.5, yes. In the Timeline Spreadsheet custom tab type, you can use the Sort function to reorder items by narrative order (rather than the default chronological order). But in my case, I prefer to create a Narrative Spreadsheet custom tab that follows the narrative order by default; indeed, this tab type does not allow switching to the timeline/chronological order.

I should admit that, in 3.5, my preference to create a custom narrative-type tab rather than using the sorting function of a custom timeline-type tab to show the narrative order may be a root cause of my proliferation of custom tabs. I have yet to meet a custom tab I didn’t like, which is probably why I ran out of keyboard shortcuts and had to find this workaround.

Now that I am fluent & confident with AT metadata and the Scrivener sync process, I should, periodically, simply create a new AT project. Perhaps with each draft or manuscript snapshot.

I do that every few days. The reason I don’t obsess about it is that I sync to Scrivener every day. Since my sync includes all of the metadata, I figure if something goes terribly wrong with AT, I can start a fresh project and sync with Scrivener to get all the metadata back. As I have Scrivener set to make a new zipped backup at the end of every writing session (which in turn is redundantly backed up), I think I’m okay not being obsessive about saving AT to a new version.

Wouldn’t it be cool to script that?

Don’t give me ideas! :rofl:

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#11

This begs the question: is there a way to save Sync Settings and Items Types? This would speed up each of those frequent New Project spin ups.

With regard to the rest of your post, WOW, just WOW…

#12

Oh, you’re thinking of creating a new project periodically. Sorry, I misunderstood. In my case, I just use the “Save as” function and give the AT project a new name. Everything is preserved that way.

Is there a reason for periodically creating a new project?

#13

My thought is that if I create a new project every so often and clean sync refresh then I can get rid of excess flotsam and jetsam. So, maybe I need to understand your response “I do that every few days.” Or maybe 3.5 has some tasty new thing that I don’t have; it’s an envy thing.

I should qualify - I do not create any meta data in AEON that does not exist in Scrivener. I bring it all in from Scrivener during sync and create a handful of custom item types to receive it.