I have over 1000 narrative events in folders and sub folders in the order I finally settled upon. I’m using the screenplay pages template so I don’t see dates, I see page numbers. How do I move that many events into a timeline so that I can refine the story’s organization by using the timelines group function to track different story simultaneously. It would take forever to add times to all of these folders and sub folders and events one at a time. How do I bring the narrative events across to the timeline without losing the order that the narrative is so helpful in making?
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If the latest version of AT3 has a suitable function, someone else will need to explain it to you.
I would export the project as a CSV file, add whatever date and time via a script or spreadsheet, reimport it, and then drag the date and time into place in the timeline view using the mouse.
I have already done this myself with Python ( although for a different writing program and a different timeline software). I defined a start time and then assigned each event the same short duration and a start time incremented by this duration, so that the sequence was clearly visible on the timeline.
If you have spreadsheet software that you know how to program, this should also be possible.
To figure out the correct columns, you can first create a small test project with a few events that all have a date and time.
If you are skilled, you can also create dependencies so that you can handle events even more easily in the timeline view. In addition, you could take into account the relationship to story arcs and create the sequence for each story arc separately.
It would be great if you could share your experiences here. Good luck!
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Thank you for the video reply! I should’ve said that I am on the beta version, too, and I’m using page numbers as dates.
I definitely need the timeline view because I need to use groups so that I can move through the story with the events in one story arc aligned with the events in another. A spreadsheet/outline doesn’t work for me.
Aeon is set up as if the narrative view is a playground for creating the actual linear story in the timeline views, but the narrative IS the story and is what screenwriters need to use all the tools on. We don’t structure our stories according to page numbers because we’re not sure how long each scene will be – we structure according to narrative position. I wish the timeline could use narrative position instead of page numbers or dates.
So my question remains: how can I view what’s now in both the narrative and the timeline spreadsheets in the timeline view – without assigning page numbers or dates for thousands of entries?
Thanks for your thinking on this.
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Thanks for the additional information. I was pretty far off the mark, I see. Sorry about that.
I definitely need the timeline view because I need to use groups so that I can move through the story with the events in one story arc aligned with the events in another. A spreadsheet/outline doesn’t work for me.
You could use the Narrative Subway view to see how events line up in the various story arcs. The key is to set the Narrative Subway tab so that the lines do not intersect but rather are separated to run in parallel. In the Content setting, you could assign, say, Story Arc items to the events (as I did in the video). Here’s a quick example:
This should give you the ability to analyze your story arcs and other elements in alignment with events. You wouldn’t have to manually enter dates, which is an understandable goal of yours.
Steve
P.S.: Although the screenshot doesn’t show it, events with overlapping dates will show in alignment. I just used the sample entries from the template; if I had time, I’d add overlapping items and separate them by Story Arc items to show that.
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@2albion, Events on the timeline are chronological and need to have a date (or page numbers in your case). They won’t appear on the timeline without one assigned, so what @SCN is suggesting above is probably the best solution for you.
If that’s not going to do what you’re after and you’re comfortable sharing your file, please send us a copy via email and we’ll see if there is anything else we can suggest.
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I am unclear how you can use page numbers instead of dates to order events in the timeline. Is this a special template.
Robert mentioned he’s using the Screenplay Runtime template, while using page numbers as dates.
So, instead of this (film runtime):
He has this (the page number):
At least, that’s what I inferred. Robert?
I’m on the beta of AT3. The sticking point is adding thousands of sequential dates or dependencies, even if it’s to a csv file. I see where you’re going with incremental start times, but don’t know how to do that. I’m curious which writing program and timeline software you also use.
I wish that Aeon could use narrative position instead of page numbers or dates in the outline view. I also like how the Narrative view automatically changes that narrative position when you drag events around.
I discovered I can show narrative folders in the Timeline by checking that off as an Item Type in Content. Then I made the Narrative Position a column and sorted by that. Then I gave them all 0 duration, then made them all consecutive dependencies, then gave them all a 30 second duration.
The problem is that when you sort by date/page number, every event in a folder shifts position because they all start at the same page and no order is maintained. But at least I can see them in the timeline now.
Yes, that’s what I did.
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You can use the template for a new file under Fiction → Screenplay Runtime.
For an existing document, you can go to the Settings cog in the upper right and change the style to Timestamp. Not exactly sure what it shifts dates to!
That was yWriter and the Open Source Timeline (which is a very basic timeline application that is not comparable to Aeon).
I can’t say much about AT3, because I still use AT2, whose file format is accessible to my scripts. For the “narrative” part of AT3, I have a self-programmed replacement that can synchronize with AT2 and also has some convenient functions for generating dates and times at least semi-automatically. It also integrates LibreOffice/OpenOffice as a “text editor.”
But to get back to your problem: Once you have a CSV file whose structure you understand and which can be imported back into AT, you have all kinds of options, provided you know how to program. Then it doesn’t matter whether there are three or a thousand events.
My spreadsheet software (OpenOffice Calc), for example, has the option of filling a cell with a formula and then applying this formula to an entire column. Instead of incrementing the date/time line by line, you could also derive it from the page numbers to create a starting point. But as I said, you can’t do this without programming skills.
A solution! And one last problem!
I need help with that (a replacement for my workaround), @SCN @Goaliedad @AeonRob @Rebecca and anyone else.
Using the method below, in a few minutes I can get all of my events to appear in the Timeline BUT I lost the necessary ability to rapidly reorder events in the Timeline Spreadsheet because that would necessitate erasing the date on any event I drag. There’s a workaround below, but there’s something you must do every time you move from the Narrative Spreadsheet to the Timeline.
To get all the Narrative Spreadsheet events into the Timeline when using the Screenplay Runtime template (it has page numbers for dates):
- Go to the Timeline Spreadsheet where the events are also visible.
- Make the Narrative Position column visible and click on its header to sort by that.
- Type 30 seconds (or any amount) into the first Duration cell.
- Copy that, highlight the entire column of events and paste it into all of that column.
- Open any excel-based spreadsheet app (such as Numbers, Sheets, LibreOffice Calc).
- In cell A1, enter: =row()
- Hit enter and that cell shows that row’s number.
- Look at Aeon to see how many events you have (1,000 in my case).
- In the Excel spreadsheet app, copy that first cell and paste it into the same number of events you have in your Aeon spreadsheet (1,000 in my case).
- This gives you a column of sequential page numbers. Copy that entire column and paste it into the Date column in your Aeon Timeline Spreadsheet (not the Narrative Spreadsheet).
- Each event now appears in the Timeline with a duration of 30 seconds and a start date that’s one page apart.
Workaround to use the Narrative Timeline to rapidly reorder events as needed:
- Drag events around in the Narrative Spreadsheet freely.
- Go to the Timeline Spreadsheet and make sure you sort by the Narrative Position again.
- Add a duration to any NEW events that lack one.
- Highlight ALL events.
- In the Item menu, click on Make Consecutive.
- This adjust all dates/pages so the Timeline is now in the same order as the Narrative Spreadsheet.
The danger of this workaround:
If you add an event in the Timeline, it won’t appear in the Narrative Spreadsheet at all. You can see in the Timeline Spreadsheet that it has no Narrative Position so you need to add it via the Inspector where it says Add To Narrative. Always add new events ONLY into your Narrative Spreadsheet. Good luck remembering that!
Do you have a better idea that my workaround?
I’ve chatted to the dev team about this one and they’re trying to work out how to improve how ‘Make Consecutive’ works so that it populates the dates in the same order they’re sorted into in the selected view. That should eliminate most of the spreadsheet activity needed for this work around.
A quick tip to add to the above is that you can filter the timeline by “Narrative > Not included in narrative” to help you pick up on any new events you’ve missed.
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I wish that the Aeon developers understood the needs of screenwriters better. I’ve shown your app to many and every single one is puzzled because the unique tools your app offers – the Timeline and Relationship views – are not available for use on the Narrative. The creation and analysis of a story needs to be done not with a chronology, but with the story as the audience receives it.
The Timeline and the Timeline Spreadsheet as they now exist are far more difficult to use for rapid reordering compared to the Narrative, but the Timeline would be so useful particularly when using Groups/Lanes. The Relationship view would be tremendously helpful to track relationships in the actual story, not the chronology. Aside from documentary filmmakers, setting chronological dates almost always comes last for every screenwriter and novelist I know.
Any chance these two features are in the pipeline for the Narrative?
I would think there’s a relatively easy coding solution for the Timeline by adding Narrative Position as an option for Date/Page Number. I don’t know how difficult it is to make the Relationship view viable for the Narrative, but I sure hope this is coming soon. These two are the best features you have to offer writers and they’re available nowhere else. It’d be a shame for Final Draft to catch up to you on the most amazing tools you’ve developed before you make them available where they’re needed in the writing process.
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In the forthcoming 3.5 (in beta now), we can create custom tabs, including a spreadsheet tab and a relationship tab based on the narrative order:
We can also create narrative tabs for the storyboard (aka “Narrative”), subway, and list views.
So far, it doesn’t look like a “Timeline” custom tab based on the narrative order is being introduced. That being the case, I wonder if the narrative Subway tab would be useful for a screenplay.
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Yes! the narrative relationship view will be one of the options available in 3.5 
If you’re using the beta and don’t see that option, you may need to use ‘Show more’ to see the full list as shown in Steve’s screenshot above.
Narrative timeline won’t be part of 3.5, but we do understand how it would be useful to the type of work you’re doing.
I’ve passed on your feedback for the dev team to consider adding to a future release.
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@AeonRob @SCN So happy that Narrative Relationships are part of the beta – which I’m on but I didn’t see it. Subway view at least as I understand it won’t work because I need to create narrative story arcs running in parallel, moving them around frequently. Oddly, Story Arcs can’t be separate tracks with events on their related lines, as far as I can tell. Or is that possible? Also, when using separate tracks only 3 can be seen on my large monitor at a time because there’s a huge distance between them.
Thanks for passing along the Timeline request to the developers – I know many working screenwriters who would love this.
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I’m not sure I fully understand what you mean by separate tracks with events on related lines, could you expand on this a little, or maybe share an image of what you’d like to be able to see?
The tracks in the subway are based on the relationships between items, much like groups on the timeline. They’ll intersect at points where the story arcs have events in common, but if you separate the layout, each arc will show the event on its own track.
If you wanted to show related lines between tracks, you might prefer to use the standard layout and use the content settings to control what’s displayed according to your current task.
You can also change the order of your tracks by dragging them in the sidepanel, if that’s helpful.
This might be happening if there is a lot of text showing in your labels. If that’s the case, there is an option in the layout settings to set the max lines per node. Reducing this should help.
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There was a lot of useful information in your last post! Like reducing the amount of text that’s shown brought the tracks closer.
Here’s what the timeline can do that the subway can’t:
Align different events vertically. I can drag one event on the subway before or after another event, but I can’t have them happen at the same time like this:
Plus the timeline events can have a duration that’s represented by the length of each line instead of a dot on the subway. I do like having a duration even though all of the page numbers or dates in the timeline are meaningless except for their order. The Narrative Position is what I really need.
I love having dependencies in the timeline so if I move one event, the related events will move with it. (I also wish there were ways of making consecutive dependences in addition to simply making them consecutive, which falls apart when something is moved. Both are helpful.)
The timeline with dates is something I’d almost never use, with page numbers is helpful, but if the narrative had a timeline I don’t know if I’d ever use the chronological views unless I was writing a documentary or, later in the process, a mystery tale.
And finally, the timeline interface is far more elegant and easier to read. I’m sure there are other things I love about it that I’m forgetting.
So! My dream would be a timeline view using narrative position instead of dates or page numbers.
Thanks for any further tips you may have and I appreciate your considering this for future upgrades.
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